Why do you think JPOP's graduation system hasn't worked well/isn't used in KPOP?

[roseychu]

Graduating means you're leaving the group to pursue other things, you've moved on. JPOP groups like AKB and Morning Musume have experienced this, and it seems to work well for them because this is a common concept in JPOP. In KPOP, After School was (I think) the first to use this system, but since then, major groups have not used this other than NCT (and this system was not them leaving completely), and even now they don't use it anymore.

Why do you think this is not a thing in KPOP? Wouldn't it be better than idols leaving the group? I think when KPOP idols leave a group, it's seen as a betrayal (see: Jessica's departure from SNSD). I'm curious to know your opinions. Also feel free to correct me if any of my info is wrong!

 

[Stan BiSH]

Graduating means you're leaving the group to pursue other things, you've moved on. JPOP groups like AKB and Morning Musume have experienced this, and it seems to work well for them because this is a common concept in JPOP. In KPOP, After School was (I think) the first to use this system, but since then, major groups have not used this other than NCT (and this system was not them leaving completely), and even now they don't use it anymore.

Why do you think this is not a thing in KPOP? Wouldn't it be better than idols leaving the group? I think when KPOP idols leave a group, it's seen as a betrayal (see: Jessica's departure from SNSD). I'm curious to know your opinions. Also feel free to correct me if any of my info is wrong!

isn't that an aspect of Japanese culture? for example Sumo wrestlers, news reporters, actresses / actors, principals, etc also have graduations ceremonies

and in all fairness many Jpop groups have messy stories of members quitting / being kicked out without any kind of goodbye

 

[roseychu]

isn't that an aspect of Japanese culture? for example Sumo wrestlers, news reporters, actresses / actors, principals, etc also have graduations ceremonies

and in all fairness many Jpop groups have messy stories of members quitting / being kicked out without any kind of goodbye

Yea for sure! Valid on both points. I just wonder why it hasn't worked in KPOP

 

[hatmixx]

i have no idea, but i think the idea is insane xD

 

[Po'etry]

It's part of marketing and protecting the brand. Brand value is retained when members don't graduate.

 

[Stan BiSH]

Yea for sure! Valid on both points. I just wonder why it hasn't worked in KPOP

i think it's the public instead of the companies that push for graduations events, if a member that has been part of a group for a while decides to leave but aren't acknowledged by the company then it ends reflecting badly on said company

also one of factors is that the Jpop scene is really fluid with their members, for example isn't uncommon for a girl that graduated from a group to end in a rival company, you don't want to burn bridges with someone that could end becoming a big name and that only has bad things to say about you

plus some of the biggest concerts for many companies are graduation concerts, many people feel "it's my last chance to see this person in this group" if properly promoted even small groups can fill entire venues

i honestly don't know if it's like that in Kpop

 

[Bchip]

I think that kpop relies on the opposite of that: the One True concept. Most kpop fans see these groups as a family and get too attached to the members, even when they're not their bias.
Also, the recruiting/training system is very different as far as i know. Kpop invests much more time in it, so it would be just a waste to let a member go after investing so much on them.

Off topic: once i was playing a JPOP manager game, and i got a notification that one member from my girlgroup was "graduating" and she would be leaving. At the time i had no idea this concept existed so i was just like "girl just girl for your graduation and comeback, why are you leaving???"

 

[roseychu]

i think it's the public instead of the companies that push for graduations events, if a member that has been part of a group for a while decides to leave but aren't acknowledged by the company then it ends reflecting badly on said company

also one of factors is that the Jpop scene is really fluid with their members, for example isn't uncommon for a girl that graduated from a group to end in a rival company, you don't want to burn bridges with someone that could end becoming a big name and that only has bad things to say about you

plus some of the biggest concerts for many companies are graduation concerts, many people feel "it's my last chance to see this person in this group" if properly promoted even small groups can fill entire venues

i honestly don't know if it's like that in Kpop

You make a lot of great points, even though the concept of "idol" exists in both countries, their definitions are very different.

One thing I noticed when working there is that even if you maybe studied engineering and got into a company with that skillset, the company will still place you in another position, like sales. I was never quite sure of the reason, maybe that kind of translates into the graduation system.

I think that kpop relies on the opposite of that: the One True concept. Most kpop fans see these groups as a family and get too attached to the members, even when they're not their bias.
Also, the recruiting/training system is very different as far as i know. Kpop invests much more time in it, so it would be just a waste to let a member go after investing so much on them.

Off topic: once i was playing a JPOP manager game, and i got a notification that one member from my girlgroup was "graduating" and she would be leaving. At the time i had no idea this concept existed so i was just like "girl just girl for your graduation and comeback, why are you leaving???"

I was thinking that. KPOP definitely relies on that kind of "we are forever" concept. GOT7 leaving JYP was a big blow to a lot of fans, but when they confirmed that they had not broken up and no one was leaving, there was a big sigh of relief. On the other hand, when Ilhoon/Soojin/B.I etc "left," it honestly feels empty for a lot of fans, and I feel like they're forced to "move on." With the graduation system it feels like the blow is soften.

Also I'm gonna need that game!

 

[Bchip]

I was thinking that. KPOP definitely relies on that kind of "we are forever" concept. GOT7 leaving JYP was a big blow to a lot of fans, but when they confirmed that they had not broken up and no one was leaving, there was a big sigh of relief. On the other hand, when Ilhoon/Soojin/B.I etc "left," it honestly feels empty for a lot of fans, and I feel like they're forced to "move on." With the graduation system it feels like the blow is soften.

Also I'm gonna need that game!

Yep. When a member leaves, fans really feel fooled because of that "we are a family" image that companies sells.

About the game, it's called Idol Manager. It's really fun...you can release albums, deal with scandals, recruit members, etc.

Save 50% on Idol Manager on Steam

Idol Manager is a business sim about conquering the entertainment industry using any means you deem necessary.

store.steampowered.com

 

[roseychu]

Yep. When a member leaves, fans really feel fooled because of that "we are a family" image that companies sells.

About the game, it's called Idol Manager. It's really fun...you can release albums, deal with scandals, recruit members, etc.

Save 50% on Idol Manager on Steam

Idol Manager is a business sim about conquering the entertainment industry using any means you deem necessary.

store.steampowered.com

Come on steam winter sale Thank you <3

 

[Bellamy]

I can only speak from my experience as nctzen: NCT Dream promoted as a regular subunit for 2 years, even if graduation was a part of their concept, the attachment was already there (after their first win in 2017 the fandom only grew more)+ the fact that only 2 members had a fixed subunit to promote as adults.
I want to believe this concept would have worked if SM was better at planning, BUT....
...the attachment the fans develop (esp the koreans) is too big, because of the culture of kpop groups: since the beginning, they talked about unity, family, working together, and supporting them as a whole+ fandom name/lightstick/fanchants with the names of the members.
It's gonna be difficult to make graduation works without damaging the popularity of a group.